3.X Insane Strategy Development

Adult mantises are
After playing around with the force composition again last night and watching Rayalot72's video, a few things comes to mind regarding what's necessary for a successful 3.2 Insane run:

1. Composition: A ratio of 1:1:1 worker warrior major works surprisingly well, however as TerrificTimmeh said might be too slow to win with. Still, a sizable investment in early taunt majors would most likely be best for killing the army ants, as well as dealing with adult mantis/cricket ambushes with minimal loss of food. I think getting an early couple of majors, about 20 workers (including nest groups), 30 warriors and the rest in majors should work the best right now.
2. An alternative harvesting route might involve getting the big plants from islands further away on the first couple of days before the day/night spawn rate gets too much, then harvesting the ones easier to get on the right side of the map (i.e. the uncontested bottom right corner one) on later nights. Haven't tried this yet to see how effective it can be.
3. Army ants must be attacked starting from Day 2 onwards to push them decisively back to the middle lane, finishing them by Day 3-4 on the leftmost lane close to the bottom side of the map.
4. Should the adult whip spider be killed on Night 3? I couldn't really capitalise on the space created until Day 4, since I gobbled up all the leaves on the right side first in my last few runs, and there's too many whip spiders etc. patrolling along the middle.
5. Selling warrior ants to get 1000+ more leaves on Day 4 for the final push. Feasible?
I will give you 1 hint. I push the army ants back to the far left lane on day 1 to assist in managing control of them for the next 3 days. That's how aggressive you need to be to get an upper edge.
 

Rayalot72

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I would like to see this level beaten at least once before any balance changes are made, but should 3.2 be adjusted? I think the creature ramp up is a bit much, even for insane, and the army ants really need to be made stronger, as the environment simply obliterates them.
 
I plan to make this the thread for figuring out the new levels in insane difficulty.

I'd recommend people not start in insane, but medium and hard to learn the levels. I'll also probably give it a few days for people to play the levels and develop their own strategies, as there's a lot that's still not known as far as optimal play goes.

Things that need to be worked on:

Leafcutter Mechanics:

What ants are best for which roles, and what mix of them is best for certain tasks?

Are S majors (stun) or T majors (taunt) better in certain scenarios?

Creature Mechanics:

What can each creature do, and what is the best way to counter them?

Where and when do they appear in levels, and how can that effect play?

Routing the Levels:

In what order should you do things in each level? What are some ways to end up in the best possible condition at different points in the mission?

What are the best nest layouts?

Which unit mix and major choice best matches what the levels expect of you?

How can you interact with the win conditions to improve your chances of winning?

___

These seem to be the most brutal insane levels we've gotten so far. Early investigation suggests that at least one of them is quite beatable, while the other might take much longer to puzzle out.

Hard for both levels is known to be beatable.
I just thought that the T meant tiny and S meant small.
 
I would like to see this level beaten at least once before any balance changes are made, but should 3.2 be adjusted? I think the creature ramp up is a bit much, even for insane, and the army ants really need to be made stronger, as the environment simply obliterates them.
At the moment the initial wave of army ants gets an attack speed boost if anything catches them which I've seen melt a pray mantis faster then I ever could. I guess it's designed to get the wave moving so you have time to meet them. Definitely wouldn't buff the army ants. I haven't been able to play the last 36 hours so hopefully tonight I can get it done.
 
I would like to see this level beaten at least once before any balance changes are made, but should 3.2 be adjusted? I think the creature ramp up is a bit much, even for insane, and the army ants really need to be made stronger, as the environment simply obliterates them.
Also, if I can't beat the level in the next few days and working around other things I've got to do; if I can't beat it I'll post and commentate a video showing my run to get the bar down to almost nothing. It is absolutely crazy; but I still firmly believe beatable. Based on what I've seen on the forums it looks like I've gotten the closest so I'll post the video if I haven't beaten it by the end of the weekend so people can hopefully build on their techniques to get closer as well.
 

Rayalot72

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WOOOO 3.2 Insane down. Will be editing the video because I also recorded a fail right before the successful attempt and will add commentary etc. Expect a video on my youtube channel in the next 6 hours :D Will post it here once it's up and running as well.

Nice, you've got the level figured out.

Starting to think maybe there shouldn't be balance changes. Unusual strategies are a staple of insane anyway, and the level not working quite as intended isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's not so different to how 2.2's aphid farms are totally ignored after the first day.
 
Nice, you've got the level figured out.

Starting to think maybe there shouldn't be balance changes. Unusual strategies are a staple of insane anyway, and the level not working quite as intended isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's not so different to how 2.2's aphid farms are totally ignored after the first day.
I don't feel like there needs to be balance changes. But if you don't take the right path this level is significantly more punishing then any other level this game has to offer. Actually you just can't physically win if you don't figure out the main necessary path as far as I can tell. As far as I'm thinking level 3.2 on insane is it's own type of level and you can't use any other difficulty to assist you in working out your playthrough. I haven't tried it yet but I could potentially end the game on hard on day 1/day 2... actually I should try beating hard on day 1 with this strategy :D Maybe not possible day 1 but day 2 I actually believe yeah I could beat hard by day 2 doing this. I will now try while I wait for OBS to convert my audio and while I wait for the video to compress before the hours of uploading wait time
 
Nice, you've got the level figured out.

Starting to think maybe there shouldn't be balance changes. Unusual strategies are a staple of insane anyway, and the level not working quite as intended isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's not so different to how 2.2's aphid farms are totally ignored after the first day.
Just completed level 3.2 Hard and ended the game roughly halfway through day 2 using my insane strategy. Might post the video tomorrow on youtube to assist people wanting to get the early game strategy for insane downpact.
 
Had some technical issues getting the audio and video to combine because the video is just over an hour so I had to sort of edit it a little. Currently uploading to my youtube channel now. Approximate load time will be 2.5 hours from this post.
 

Rayalot72

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Very cool route in 3.2, it's particularly interesting how you maintain and utilize map control through your early rush, an advantage you carry for the whole level. It never even occurred to me that it's far better to turn off combat when harvesting things in the middle lane at night, I'd always assumed you'd take too many losses that way, but it seems you actually take less.

I didn't realize you could cut of their boost like that just by ensuring it occurs after the day ends, it'd probably be way more difficult to manage them so early on without that mechanic.
 
Very cool route in 3.2, it's particularly interesting how you maintain and utilize map control through your early rush, an advantage you carry for the whole level. It never even occurred to me that it's far better to turn off combat when harvesting things in the middle lane at night, I'd always assumed you'd take too many losses that way, but it seems you actually take less.

I didn't realize you could cut of their boost like that just by ensuring it occurs after the day ends, it'd probably be way more difficult to manage them so early on without that mechanic.
Yeah map control was an after thought but with everyone struggling on this map I realisedif everyone else could just get map control as well they'd have an easier time building a strategy on this level. Without it you're attempts are dead in the water. It's unique to not have combat on at night. But I weighed it up because your combat ants are the better harvesters and they take a hit.
 
Not sure if this is the place but have just completed formicarium challenge 3 on insane as well - does that count as 3.X? If so, video available on my youtube channel if you are looking for some assistance/tips on beating that too.
 

Rayalot72

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Not sure if this is the place but have just completed formicarium challenge 3 on insane as well - does that count as 3.X? If so, video available on my youtube channel if you are looking for some assistance/tips on beating that too.
Eh, it is insane, but the formicarium is a bit of a weird beast, since you can just totally outlevel everything.
 
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